The Walking Dead Forum

I thought the episode was pretty decent.

While I don't find many of the characters compelling at this point, I find the situations they find themselves in certainly an interesting topic for discussion.

The thought of living in a world so dark and dreary that murder of someone potentially innocent for ones own safety, is the general group concensus is very interesting the think about. A room full of people, who we can assume used to be far more rational, have all but disintergrated and only one old man will speak up for morality.

Even more ironically, as someone from the younger generation who often finds some of the ideas of the older generations dated, I couldn't help but find Dale's view just that.

He made some very good points, but wishing won't change the world they're in and who's to say that they'd have such an easy time siding with him if they were on that farm? Survival is a basic human instinct and while humanity is to be admired and even strived for, would you follow it to the danger of yourself or the ones you love?

Granted, there are still elements of the show that really piss me off, as mentioned with super strong ninja zombies.

They really missed a great chance here. How is it we're in the second season and we've not yet had one really great scene of someone having been infected with a scratch and having to accept their own inevitable transformation into a zombie?

I feel this was a great situation to give that ago and they really blew it.

Would Daryl's views on the world have changed, knowing he was going to burn up and zombify?

We'll never know now and all we've been left with is gut rippingly strong zombies.

Right now this shows strength isn't the characters, it's the world they're inhabiting and the situations they face. They really need to start focusing more on those strengths and in doing so, they might make the characters a bit more enjoyable, whether they mean to or not.

@Funky_Pasta_Tommy said:

How is it we're in the second season and we've not yet had one really great scene of someone having been infected with a scratch and having to accept their own inevitable transformation into a zombie?

I feel this was a great situation to give that ago and they really blew it.

First season spoilers:

But I do agree, having Dale just get infected and having to deal with that would have been a much better handling of the situation.

Any episode that kills Dale is a fantastic episode. Nobody likes a metagamer.

Also... Holy crap are Carl's parents terrible. Your boy's a snot, a bloodthirsty idiot, and he's wandering off for hours unobserved in a zombie apocalypse. Tan that boy's hide! You're supposed to be southern; act like it!

I was shocked that Carl died, but it's about time a major character got offed. Actually, I thought that Shane was going to be the death of him at some point. I loved the character, but even so he got a little too preachy for me during this episode.

Carl is creeping me out. How the hell does he manage to sneak away and why isn't Lori watching him like a responsible mother should? Oh yeah, she's too busy washing dishes and doing laundry. You know, things a woman should really be doing. I kid, but that's the impression I got from her a few episodes ago...

I really like this show, but I'm also really tired of these people who seem completely inept in every way. Lorie is killing me, and her son Carl is just being insane. He's not doing a good job at portraying it either if that's what we're supposed to believe. He just comes off as a poor actor. Granted he's young, but that doesn't give him a pass when I'm looking for some great TV. The Wire had some awesome child actors.

Also, the part with him and the zombie was just ridiculous. I don't expect him to be good with a gun, but that zombie seriously slapped the gun out of his in slow-motion and then he scrambled to the ground so pathetically. He did the fake struggle where he fumbled around without making any real attempt at moving, so lame. Come on. Do another take, it really hurts the show for me.

I want smart, believably capable people and sometimes we get it but not nearly enough. I would like more Maggie, she does a good job at selling it generally.

@Funky_Pasta_Tommy: You make some great points.

Some observations:

• I lol'd when no one gave a shit about Hershel and his cows. Dale was like, "What happened?" "My cows have--" "ANYWAY, what about this Randall thing?!"
• Carl will be a serial killer when he grows up. Lori looking after Carl is like Lori doing anything effectively (cool simile, bro). Not only was she not curious about how muddy he was after his zombie encounter, but she didn't think it would be smart to keep him around the camp when her husband was going to EXECUTE A DUDE 100 feet away. She is the worst character in television right now.
• I was apologetic for the surprise zombie horde on the highway scene at the premiere because it ended up being tense and satisfying, but when did zombies become ninjas? Not only did the zombie sneak up on Dale, but he came from the direction Dale JUST CAME FROM, IN AN OPEN FIELD! How did they figure that? The show seems to have a vague sense of what zombies can and cannot do, and just let's things fly for convenience.
• I'm working on my Shane impression. It consists of open hostility, no eye-contact, and a lot of "Let me tell you something..." All I need is a sea-green Honda Fit or Hyundai whatever to drive around in and some Doc Martens.
• I agreed with Dale, but clearly he hasn't been going anywhere as far as character growth this season. He's like an older, sadder version of Duckie from Pretty in Pink, except at the end, replace Kristy Swanson with a zombie that rips open his stomach. Dale trying to channel Fonda from 12 Angry Men went on a little too long, too. It's important, I guess, but I just wanted the show to end.
• T-Boz had like, one line this episode, and it was interrupted by Dale, so obviously Dale had to die. How they handle T-Boz is fucking embarrassing. It would be less racist if this show was an all-white cast.

It's the zombie zombie apocalypse, keep an eye on your darn kids . . I mean, keep them with you at all times, even if you're living on a cushy farm surrounded by a swamp, that's still near enough to a highway and town full of dead roamers. Carl is a kid, so he's due his stupid mistakes, maybe more at this time, but yes Carl, Dale's death is your fault . . . besides Dale walking alone in a field which kinda symbolized his role in the group at that point.

1st thing, I've disliked this portrayal of Dale (versus the book), but I understand that Shane is the wildcard that makes this 'universe' different in a lot of ways, so yes, I've hate what Dale has done in the form of being a 'poison pill' and silent button pusher . . . I didn't dislike him because he's got a moral center, I've disliked that he's as much of a back stabber with going to one or two people to influence outcomes for the entire group. He exerted as much moralizing influence to sway beforehand and too a degree, made Shane more like Shane that we see. Without concrete evidence he told Lorie that he believed Shane killed Otis to save himself (at a time when Dale and he were near deadly terms themselves), but he did not tell Lorie or Rick about Shane leveling a weapon at Rick when much early on Shane and Rick were on the hunt in the woods. Manipulator, . . . that's the word I was looking for. If were not the audience, we wouldn't see him as a manipulative person.

So 2nd, SPOILER if you hadn't already been told of who died in this episode, stop now . . . . . . . . . but I'm only saddened that Dale died, but glad he's out of the way. He was ill fitted for this new world, Shane being suited for it or so he would or did say. I've been expecting Shane to put a bullet in the guy and really, Shane could have dropped him so many ways along the way but never did. 3rd, I'm not saying Shane is a good guy, he's conflicted, as much shattered by the new world and alone in his own mind since he can't have the family he thought he gained, and made all the more dangerous by the events and people of his recent encampment. Shane can and probably will have his moment in front of a gun aimed at him, but not this night.

So far, the second half of the season has been a better imo, more momentum, accept for maybe Rick's back and forth angst of what to do next. I'm glad the show is pulling itself out of the swamp, and sad that it'll mean more shambling deaths. Dale, I really liked you in the books and your relationships there.

Also, I agree that zombies shouldn't have so much sneaking power . . . I can only believe Dale was so horrified by the disemboweled cow and its agony that he couldn't think that he was in the same danger (on such a comfortable dark night out in the middle of nowhere with no one but his conflict to keep him warm)......

As far as decisions go, I don't think it wasn't without reason or skill what Rick or Daryl did. The torture they put the character through was interesting in that I saw it as partly prisoner of war and part police interrogation. Rick had bad vibes and dealings with the young man's group, so he's got to figure if there is guilt by association or deeds. He's got to figure it out in a world now overrun with zombies, zombies that have made living with human strangers just as dangerous. I also see Daryl as someone who's seen a mixture of humanity, mostly the bad side, and he may have an insight on wolves in sheeps' clothing. Frankly, I don't think that they discovered anything damning of the young man's story or actions, but coupled with the world they live in and the bad encounter at the bar, it weighed against them risking their future. Let's say the swamp would not deter well armed greedy living humans.

@Alex_Carrillo: Dude, chill out. The guy made a flippant comment. I hardly think he actually condones the murder/death of children. Though I must say, Carl is a bit of a dumbass. Also, this show is kind of built off characters meeting grisly ends right?

@davosplat said:

@Alex_Carrillo: Dude, chill out. The guy made a flippant comment. I hardly think he actually condones the murder/death of children. Though I must say, Carl is a bit of a dumbass. Also, this show is kind of built off characters meeting grisly ends right?

I'm almost certain he's a pedophile, too.

Could just be the zombie was enticed by the prospect of eating plump Dale, coupled with it's built up hunger from being stuck in the woods, and also having some bony ass fingers and absolutely no capacity for pain, that all gave it enough checkmarks for disemboweling a particularly soft human.

It's just how the zombie was able to get behind Dale that keeps picking at me. Assuming the zombie was low to the ground eating the cow, the zombie would have had to notice Dale approaching, stay low to the ground under cover of grass, circle around him, and stand behind him waiting for him to turn around before pouncing. That's just some drama-serving craziness.

Wait what? i thought season 2 was finished,damn my Brit behindness. Downloading follow up episodes after the barn incident. Excited to see more of this

@Daftasabat said:

Wait what? i thought season 2 was finished after episode 13. Is this a new episode?

We just got the 11th episode of season 2 yesterday.

@Alex_Carrillo said:

@myketuna said:

I guess I understand people's hate to Dale (he's preachy, he's such a bitch, whatever else people that don't like Dale think), but we should all agree that Carl is such a fucking ass. He really takes after his mother, doesn't he? This episode marks one of the few times I shouted at my tv ("Shoot the motherfucker, goddamn it!"). That said, I kind of like where this ended up even if it meant Dale had to die. Maybe Carl WILL become even colder, but if it means he'll stop being such a child, then I'm all for it.

Which is kind of weird that I'm telling Carl not to be that, but I remember myself at 11-12 and I already knew a hell of a lot more about world and morality than this fucking kid. I think if Carl was younger on the show like in the comics, I wouldn't be so angry at him. *sigh* I just ranted, didn't I?

Not only that, you also humblebragged like a motherfucker, which as far as I'm concerned makes you the worst humanity has to offer.

Sorry about that *sigh* I was/am just so mad at this damn kid. And not the actual kid (he's just playing his part), the fictional kid. Terrible fucking character. But like I said, I hope he becomes interesting now that he has to deal with what happened. Though like many have stated, I'm sure this kid will just get worse because of this. But Shane got messed up too and I thought that was the best thing that happened to him.

Anyway, I am also glad I wasn't the only person looking at T-Dog during that meeting. Maybe now that one of the bigger characters is dead, he'll get some more...stuff to do. Anything. Two lines in two episodes is not good.

@SolidOcelot: Absolutely agree, lol